Thread started by playtime
playtime 222 » Feature requestsMorning. I'm currently putting the scanner through it paces and uploading a bunch of instructions. It got me thinking. I also have a bunch of (mostly ancient) kits that are missing instructions. No one knows my pain (well, I do still want to build the bloody things one day AND my OCD will be kicking in when these are stuck without resolution on the Contributions screen 😄). So, enough waffle and on to a proposal outline.
As someone with kits with missing instructions, I would like to be able to:
1. Request that a set of instructions are uploaded (so people DO know my pain 😉 ).
2. Be notified when they have been uploaded.
3. Find/navigate to the instructions of similar kits if the exact ones are not available.
4. Similarly, 1 & 2 for 3.
5. Indicate the number of requests (e.g. priority) for a given set of missing instructions.
6. The ability for consumers to feedback on uploaded instructions e.g. text too small.
Implementation suggestion:
I note the Instructions section currently only shows up for a kit when it has instructions so the following would mean a re-think.
1. For a kit with no instructions, show the Instructions section with a Request button which builds on the Like mechanism - where Like => Request. Label it clearly as a Request to avoid confusion.
2. PM the requesting members when instructions become available.
5. In the existing contributions section, order them by 'Likes' and indicate the number of 'Likes'.
6. Tricky. It could be as simple as PMs to the original author or a general wall post or a note against the uploaded instruction in the Contributions section. Not sure how to indicate Done/Resolved.
3. Tricky. Many variations come to mind. e.g. I have an ancient Hales Lightning and Harrier. I have the decals but no instructions but they are Hasegawa reboxes so to build them, any 1/72 Hasegawa would do. So the first idea I think would be to list the similar kits that have instructions available.
3.1 UX - DO 3 as a small table with Kit picture as a link to the kit details and a direct link to the instructions.
3.2 Instead of 3.1, indicate on the product timeline which kits have instructions. (Not so keen on this for quite a few reasons including I feel its a PITA for implementation 😉 )
1.1 Indicate that instructions for any of the kits in the same 'family' are acceptable.
Not remotely urgent for me. Just an idea.
1 19 March 2021, 08:04
Boris BAs a more general remark connected to your 3rd point, I wonder if the Timeline features (list of re-boxings of the same kit) is not under-used in SM. What I am describing only makes sense if it's technically possible to implement, of course, but there is a wealth of information available there that is not so easy to retrieve while the database 'knows' it.
In your case, for instance, all straight reboxings (new box) as well as 'new decals' ones would have pefectly accurate build instructions, and so should (possibly) be easy to find from kits with missing instructions.
In other words, I wonder if there is a way to integrate the information concerning reboxings as shortcuts to relevant features :
"New Box" means same build instructions, same painting instructions (and materials/colors), same decal options, same build reviews, parts breakdown and quality,...
'New decals" means the same except for what relates to decals and painting...
"New Parts" still means that the general build (quality of parts, fit, options) will be similar, so Kits Reviews are relevant (obviously, this is not hard and fast, but it's what we do when we look up reviews of a Hasegawa Spitfire IX with clipped wings because a review of their kit with full wingspan is missing, or a Takom Tiger with a different turret, etc.)
Organizing the access to information according to the Timeline info may not be practical without a major architectural change of the site, but if it is do-able without too much trouble (or at least in part), it would be useful to most, I think.
27 March 2021, 16:43
playtime 222That was exactly my intention - some of the information can be derived from existing Timeline data as a starting point. It's a balance of 'who would even use this feature' vs what some might perceive as cluttering up the UI. There are plenty of ways to achieve a decent result.
For my personal interests, 1,2 & 5 are the core of this. Its no biggie to go and click on a few of the New Tool boxes in the same timeline in search of a set of instructions.
29 March 2021, 15:31
Spanjaardhummmm. interesting
although it reminds me that I have quite a few kits in the list of missing instructions... my plan was to use the scanner in the office. but has not been possible for a year now..... 🙁
29 March 2021, 16:01
Martin OostromAdd a red triangle in the upper left corner of a kit in the timeline indicating it has instructions?
29 March 2021, 16:24
Spanjaarda couple of weeks ago, i also suggested to add something to mark which ones in the time line are in your stash and wishlist. like S and W in a corner.
29 March 2021, 16:28
playtime 222Yeah this is what I mean by UX issues - it won't be that clear to many people and it will obscure the data in the timeline or be too small to see.
29 March 2021, 16:32
Starbase101Red typically means error/alert/issue/etc. I would recommend green or blue, something indicating instructions are added rather than missing.
30 March 2021, 03:38
playtime 222We should start a different thread if we want to discuss the pros and cons of various scanning methods😉
30 March 2021, 06:34
Boris BMaking the Timeline more informative (displaying more info) is maybe a good idea, and at least better than nothing (if it works visually). But what I meant in my (probably over-complicated) post, was to use the information 'related' to the timeline (rather than the timeline itself) to improve the workings of the site.
To be more clear : thanks to the information included in the timeline section, the site 'knows' that Kit A (Hasegawa SDB Dauntless) is a "ReBox/New Decals" of Kit B (Accurate Miniature SBD). So as a user looking for instructions (or reviews, or parts breakdown, etc.) for Kit A, I should be easily pointed to Kit B which has instructions (or reviews, parts breakdown, etc.), as well as to any other Rebox of that kit.
At the moment, if I'm looking for instructions and they are not in the kit's entry, I have to try my luck at every kit in the timeline, one by one.
Yes, we could tag the tiny icons on the timeline to mark the presence of Instructions, but how to do so without making it confusing ? And what about if I'm looking for a review ? Another tag ?
For Reviews, we have the convenience of the buttong "All Previews in scale", which is nice if you want to compare different moldings (the Hasegawa/Accurate vs. the Monogram SBD). So would it be possible to also offer a button/feature/sub-choice that shows "All Previews of Reboxings" to limit it to that moulding ?
And similarly, buttons for the other features : "Show Instructions from Reboxings", "Show Box Contents from Reboxings", "Show Decal Options from Reboxings/New box", and so on.
30 March 2021, 10:34
Starbase101Instead of physical markers/tags on the timeline which could end up being small, cryptic, and clutter-some, maybe a hover-over context popup for each kit in a timeline. The popup could then communicate more-legibly whether a kit entry includes instructions, reviews, box contents, projects, etc. This information could be automatically extracted from database entries and wouldn't need to be "composed" by anybody (thus maintenance-free). Then you simply move the mouse around a timeline to quickly see whether any kit has the information being looked for. (Sorry phone and tablet users, this would be a desktop-only feature, aka "real" computers.)
Sidenote, my opinion regarding downloadable instructions is aligned with copyright infringement. Many kit instructions include a copyright date, and if the kit is a licensed product then also a copyright date for the licenser. Scanning of instructions from for-sale kits and making them freely available is no different than ripping a CD or DVD and giving away free copies. Making copies for personal use is allowed under U.S. law. For example, making a digital copy of model kit instructions so you can zoom in or add markups without "damaging" the original. Or ripping a CD you bought so you can listen to it on your phone. But uploading these copies for anybody to download? Not exactly legal, depending on your country's copyright laws. As far as I know, Scalemates does not have written permission from kit manufacturers for distributing instructions, and neither does anybody who buys a model kit. Just because you CAN do something doesn't always mean that you SHOULD.
30 March 2021, 13:51
Spanjaardmaybe there is anohter option. a filter to be added to the time time line, to show only those with contents added, instructions added, etc. then , there is nothing to add to the (small) pictures.
30 March 2021, 14:18
playtime 222@Starbase - 1) Your concerns are legit 2) IANAL. My experience when making the 40 odd ones I had available recently - I specifically looked for copyright marks on quite a few. Not a sausage. Also some were freely available online already e.g. Revell and HK with no dire warnings regarding re-distribution. So, yes, everyone should check the ones they are thinking of uploading and err on the side of caution.
30 March 2021, 22:24
playtime 222Another thought. For the ones that are available freely online, may I suggest the possibility of setting a a URL to the manufacturer's resource (with all the usual caveats regarding a process to regularly test for dead links)?
30 March 2021, 22:29
playtime 222Not surprised where Lucasarts or Disney involved 😄 However, I missed that one. It's precisely why I proposed the ability to URL to these too.
31 March 2021, 18:29
Starbase101Alright, here's one that is not Lucasfilm: ibb.co/yfzHdrP
(Besides, the Lucasfilm copyright is supplemental to the Revell printed instructions due to being a licensed product.) Linking to a manufacturer's asset (if allowed within their terms and conditions) would be safer than hosting independent downloads.
31 March 2021, 22:18
playtime 222Oh. My edit of my last post disappeared 🙁 Yes, I've gone through a handful more carefully and a lot do have a copyright mark.
1 April 2021, 07:04
Boris BMy opinion would be more on the side of play time (pun intended), but perhaps the discussion about what should be published on ScaleMates is best left to Tim, no ?
Then we can get back to the issue of how to make the information that is on the site more accessible.
1 April 2021, 09:57
Starbase101I still believe the Timeline is the best place for quickly seeing all information associated with a kit family. The ease of being able to simply hover over the kits and see contextual stats in a popup (if done well) would be intuitive, quick, and not change any of the existing page aesthetics. Then, if something catches your eye, like a release having box contents populated, all you need to do is click on the kit you're currently hovered over. No cryptic symbols or colors.
@Spanjaard's filter idea is good too, but I wouldn't recommend Timeline filtering on a product's page - instead have it as a feature of the Full Timeline (seen when you click the "Full history" button). That page has a lot of real-estate for a filters sidebar on the right similar to search results. This is probably more intuitive than a popup approach, and consistent with other areas of the site. The filter checkboxes would then be things like "Has project(s)", "Has box contents", "Has EAN", "Has review(s)", etc.
@scalemates, why does the timeline's button read "Full history" (which being a title should actually be "Full History" ) but the page it opens is titled "Full timeline" (again, should be "Full Timeline" )? Shouldn't the title of the opened page correlate with the button text?
1 April 2021, 13:34
scalematesIn different order:
1) Full history label, agreed + fixed
2) I'm in favor of the approach where in the right section "alternative" content is displayed. This is based on timeline intelligence, but not in the timeline
- eg. Here, the instruction sheets of this kit are missing, however scalemates now instantly proposes an alternative based on the timeline. (logic not complete, but I think you get the point?)
155 mm Howitzer (Airfix 07362-6, 1:35)
3) Similar intelligence could be added elsewhere
12 April 2021, 18:45
Martin Oostrom2) example looks good. You show instructions from the oldest kit, while a newer one is also available. Intentionally because of the 'new parts' in the newer kit?
12 April 2021, 18:54
scalematesRight now I only go back in time... and I pick the first one matching. It is not perfect but simple and fast.
eg. M1 155mm Howitzer (Italeri 6581, 1:35) takes the PDF from the previous linked kit from 1980 (and not the 1982 one)
12 April 2021, 18:57
Boris BHi Tim, That is great. I'm glad it's possible to implement this idea of information based on what's included in the timeline. And I agre that timelines do not need to be overloaded (if anything, the opoosite, but that's a different topic).
Would it not make sense to indicate the most recent relevant information, though ? In general, I would say that more recent instructions sheets are better designed and more accurate.
13 April 2021, 11:01